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Identity

Non-Americans are sharing the ‘dead giveaway’ someone is American and they are pretty right

The dead giveaway is when they call me "honey" or "sweetie" or "darling."

americans, american tourists, acting american
via Flickr, Flickr, and Flickr

Three American tourists enjoying the sights.


One of the most interesting things about traveling the world is noticing how people from your country are a bit different from the place you’re visiting. In America, you’re mostly around fellow countrymen so it’s hard to notice the things that make us stand out.

But when you travel abroad, you quickly notice that no matter how hard you try to blend in, there are a lot of dead giveaways that show people you’re from the states that go way beyond your accent.

A Reddit user named ILoveTallWomen asked the online forum “Non-Americans of Reddit, what is a dead giveaway that somebody is American?” to see what they think makes us stand out. “I'm not American and am curious about what other foreigners think,” they added.

There was one answer that people in the thread repeated over and over again—Americans are very friendly people. Countless commenters noted that Americans will approach anyone and start up a conversation. As a person from the U.S., I think that’s a positive stereotype. There’s nothing wrong with being overly friendly.

​People also noted that Americans tend to carry themselves with a lot of confidence and have an abundance of infectious enthusiasm.

On the negative side of things, a lot of people also noted that Americans are loud and have questionable fashion sense. We stand out abroad because we love staying comfortable by wearing white socks and sneakers on just about any occasion.

Maybe we’re happy because our feet don’t hurt?

Here are 17 of the best responses to the dead giveaways that someone is American.

Upworthy Podcast: Dead Giveaways Someone is American

On a recent episode of Upworthy Weekly, hosts Alison Rosen and Tod Perry discuss the internet's hottest, most uplifting and most amusing topics - including d...

1.

The most popular poster shared a list:

  • Wearing sneakers with anything
  • Big smiles, firm handshakes
  • Lots of Northface products
  • Renting Segways for sightseeing tours (sometimes using those on cobblestone)
  • Using big adjectives generously ("Wow, your aunt's kidney stones sound awesome!", "This Euroshopper beer tastes great!")
  • Clapping and cheering
  • Telling one's whole life story within 15 minutes of meeting them
  • Loving stories and narratives in general (which makes them fun companions) — [Deleted]

2.

"Apart from the accent? Mostly its the 'prepared for anything' look they have about them (fanny pack, backpack, bottled water, camera pouch) compared to various other tourists - Asians tend to herd together for safety, while Europeans vary between blend-right-in Scandinavian to designer-brands-everywhere French and traffic-laws-are-for-others Italian. But Americans are the only ones who seem to view a perfectly civilised, modern city like some kind of uncharted jungle that doesn't have places to shelter in the rain or buy cheap bottled water." — Yorkshire_Pudden

3.

"Incredibly loud but incredibly friendly." — kevio17

4.

"I asked my wife (Japanese) she said 'In Japan I can spot Americans by the way they dress. Compared to Europeans, Americans tend to lack fashion sense.'" — RegionFree

5.

"When you can hear them before you see them." — C1t!zen_Erased

6.

"'On the streets they are instantly recognizable. They walk in an ugly indifferent manner, usually with their hands in their pockets. Or they're leaning against a pole or wall with a newspaper in their hand and gum in their mouth. According to the people who met them they are more human than the English, for example, whenever someone needs help they do it quicker and better than the English.' — My Grandpa in the Netherlands. In a letter to his sister. June 4th 1945." — MidnightWineRed

7.

"North Face jackets. I went to college in the US (I'm not American) and when I went home for my first winter break wearing my brand new North Face jacket my friend asked me if I was given American citizenship with the purchase." — merbonobo

8.

"I'm English, but I've lived here for 14 years. It's pretty obvious just from your demeanour. Americans generally are more confident in the way they present themselves, most other countries tend to be more reserved. Walk into a room full of different nationalities, I guarantee the American person will be the first to introduce themselves. It's a confidence thing, and I admire it." — zerbey

9.

"When I was visiting Germany in college, a girl said to me, 'Do you know how I know you're an American? You wear white socks.' Needless to say, I haven't worn white socks since." — ars3nal

10.

"We (Americans) describe distances in driving time, as opposed to miles or kilometers. My European relatives always make fun of me for having no clue how far away the next town is, but knowing exactly how long it takes to get there." — hbombs86

11.

"Canadian here...the dead giveaway is when they call me 'honey' or 'sweetie' or 'darling.' I fucking love Americans and I love those terms of endearment!" — AraEnzeru

12.

"Dead giveaway: They're surprised we can drink a beer (or any alcohol) in public in my country." — P1r4nha

13.

"European here ... there's a noticeable trend among Americans to wear jeans, t-shirts, and hooded sweaters when they're abroad. Lots of branded goods too (North Face, A&F, Hollister, Ed Hardy mostly). And in summer, a great percentage of the cargo-shorts-wearers are Americans. But among all that, visible tattoos on otherwise 'normal-looking' people (i.e. not looking like street thugs) are a common indicator too. Americans love tats." — I_AM_A_IDIOT_AMA

14.

"In WWII, my grandpa's company had a problem with German spies. At night the guards could not tell if intruders were returning patrols or enemy soldiers; especially since the spies spoke with flawless American accents. Before opening the gates, they tried asking questions like "What's the capital of Nebraska?" but it didn't always work since the Germans were highly trained and could answer most of the trivia questions. Finally, they stumbled upon a simple but effective test. They would ask them to sing the 4th verse of the Star-Spangled Banner. He told me 'If they start singing, then you shoot 'em. No American knows the 4th verse.' Turns out the whole song had been included in one of the German espionage training manuals." -- [Deleted]

15.

"They ask you what you do." — Askalotl

16.

"They say 'like' a lot and seem to start sentences with 'so' for no apparent reason. Good bunch, though." — [Deleted]

17.

"MM/DD/YYYY." — dusmeyedin


This article originally appeared on 2.20.23

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Joy

Hunger in affluent communities: How a Silicon Valley food bank is fighting food insecurity

We can all help fight hunger nationwide with one simple shift in the way we grocery shop.

Photo credit: Canva

Food insecurity is an issue in communities across the United States.

When people hear “Silicon Valley,” hunger isn’t usually the first thing that comes to mind. Instead, most think “global tech hub” and “wealth.” Named after the silicon used in computer chips, this renowned region is home to nearly 3 million residents and is famous for offering some of the highest salaries in the United States.

Given Silicon Valley’s association with wealth, it’s easy to overlook that not everyone living there is affluent. The high cost of living in the area makes it challenging for those without high-paying jobs to make ends meet. Many residents, including those who work full-time, struggle with basic living expenses.

That’s why Second Harvest of Silicon Valley helps provide food to more than 500,000 people across Santa Clara and San Mateo counties. The COVID-19 pandemic and subsequent inflation have prevented many families from getting ahead, making the food bank’s role crucial in providing access to nutritious food.

However, the high cost of living in Silicon Valley is also affecting Second Harvest. Despite the evident need in the community, the food bank had to close its largest warehouse in June 2024 due to rising rent costs.

donationsVolunteers help sort food bank donations.Photo credit: Canva

"Every single week, we receive more than 85 tractor-trailer loads of food. All of that food gets handled at our warehouses and goes back into the community," Second Harvest of Silicon Valley CEO Leslie Bacho told NBC. "Unfortunately, this is our largest facility that we are closing, so we're having to just figure out how we can have that work get done other places."

To help maintain the flow of food, the Albertsons Companies Foundation Nourishing Neighbors Program and O Organics gave Second Harvest of Silicon Valley a $200,000 grant. And they weren’t the only organization to receive funding. Thirty nonprofits received a total of $30,000 in grants during the O Organics $30K in 30 days campaign this past summer to help ease food insecurity. Hunger is an ongoing issue that requires continuous funding, and initiatives like these help ensure that food reaches those in need.

How can we all help make sure people get the food they need?

There are so many worthy organizations that need support to fight hunger, and there are numerous ways to help, from making direct donations and organizing food drives to volunteering. Enhancing these efforts, O Organics provides an easy way for everyone to contribute consistently by simply changing how we grocery shop.

Every time you choose an O Organics product, you not only provide nutritious food for your own family but also help someone facing food insecurity. Through the “Fight Hunger. Serve Hope” program, O Organics has contributed nearly $14 million over the past two years to reduce food insecurity, enabling 56M meals and counting to help fight hunger in local communities.

O Organics helps fight food insecurity.images.albertsons-media.com

Doesn’t organic food cost more than non-organic?

People often assume that organic food is more expensive, but that’s not always true. Many organic products cost the same or even lower than their non-organic equivalents, especially when comparing private label brands like O Organics to national products.

O Organics has products in every aisle of the store, making it easier than ever to find organic products that suit your family’s needs. Purchasing O Organics products also helps support organic agriculture. Small changes that benefit both the planet and its people can add up, and simply choosing one product instead of another can make a significant difference.

No matter where people face food insecurity, whether in Silicon Valley or communities across the U.S., we can all find ways to help. Learn more about how O Organics is helping fight hunger here and look for the O Organics brand at your local Albertsons Companies grocery store, including Albertsons, Safeway, Vons, ACME, Shaw’s, Jewel-Osco and Tom Thumb.
Pets

Research shows why you should always pet your dog before leaving the house

via Pixabay

One of the most wonderful things about having a dog is how attached they become to their owners. I work from home and my Jack Russel terrier, Scout, lies next to me on his bed for most of the day. The only time he leaves my office is for a sip of water or to go outside and sun his belly on the porch.

That's why whenever I leave the house and can't take Scout with me, I wonder, "Does he miss me? Is he sad that he's alone?"

Studies show that our dogs miss us the moment we leave the house and that feeling slowly intensifies until we are gone for about four hours and they have a "plateau of melancholy." That's why the longer you're away, the more excited your dog is when you return home.

The moment I pull up in my car Scout begins to howl like a wolf trying to contact someone who's miles away. It's like, "Dude, I'm 30 feet away. Give me a second to grab the groceries out of the trunk."

Researchers from the Universities of Pisa and Perugia, Italy have found that if you give your dog some affection before you leave the house they'll have less anxiety while you're away.

They conducted experiments with 10 dogs between the ages of one and 11 without attachment issues. The group was composed of seven mixed-breed dogs, one Labrador retriever, one Hovawart, and one Chihuahua.

Participants in the study walked their leashed dogs into a fenced area where they were greeted by a researcher who took their dog's heart rate. In the first test, after the owners walked their dogs into the area, they talked with a researcher for one minute then left without giving the dog any special attention.

In the second test, the dog owners petted the dog during their interaction with the researcher.

In both tests, the owners left the fenced area and hid far enough away so that the dog couldn't smell them.

After the owners left, the dogs looked for them for about three minutes on average. After the owners returned, the researchers measured the dogs' levels of the stress hormone cortisol as well as their heart rates.

The researchers found that whether the dogs were petted or not, their cortisol levels were unchanged. But their heart rate showed a marked decrease if the owners petted them before leaving. Researchers later watched videos of the dogs and found that the ones that were petted showed " behaviors indicative of calmness for a longer period while waiting for the owner's return."

Next time I'm ready to leave the house and Scout follows me to the front door after saying, "Sorry bud, you can't go with me on this trip," I'll kneel down and give him a little extra love and attention.

Maybe that way he won't howl like the house is on fire when I pull up in my car after a trip to the grocery store.

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Joy

The 8 best holiday movies to watch while you're bunkering down with your family

Almost nothing improves a family gathering like a great movie.

We've all been there. And even if we haven't, we can imagine the scene: Sitting around with your family on Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Year's Eve and even respective holiday in between. There are countless opportunities for joy and connection but also equal opportunities for boredom and awkwardness during times when we are supposed to be savoring the season and the company of those closest to us.

Sometimes those trying times are as simple as lacking a shared pop culture moment to laugh, cry and be inspired by in each other's company. In that spirit, we've come up with eight of our favorite holiday films. After all, everyone loves a good movie. Still, not everyone is down to watch the same Christmas movies. And some people, frankly, aren't fans of them at all. But let me assure you, these films cut across religious, generational, gender and cultural boundaries.

So, sit back, load up your Amazon Video account (or other streaming service) and check one of these films out. Even if you've already seen them 100 times, they can take an entirely new meaning and experience when viewed through the holiday lens, especially in the shared company of our families and closest friends.



8. Love, Actually

The 2003 romantic comedy has steadily risen up the ranks to become quite possibly the number one current holiday movie. It was an international hit during its initial run but has gained steam, especially over the past 5 years. Much like The Office and Friends, this movie has become a cultural phenomenon with people who were too young to see it when it first aired. If you're under 30, it's truly bizarre and delightful to see Andrew Lincoln in a deeply romantic role. It's just as weird as it was for those of us who primarily knew him as a big softie before he became the zombie slaughtering, ex-cop protagonist of The Walking Dead. And that's just up top. With an absolutely packed cast that included Liam Neeson, Keira Knightley, Emma Thompson and Colin Firth, it's a film you can watch over and over again. It's just naughty enough for the jaded lovers and sweet and wholesome enough for anyone who needs a powerful, transformational love story around the holidays. And honestly, who doesn't need that right now?

Watch it Now: Love, Actually, $8.99; on Amazon


7. Die Hard

You're damn right it's a Christmas movie. Some people like to pretend there's still a debate about that. Well, "some people" can go walk barefoot across a floor of glass. Just kidding! The movie that spawned an entire generation of cinematic knockoffs, "Die Hard ... but in space!" holds up incredibly well. At the time, Bruce Willis was the co-star of the 80's sitcom sensation Moonlighting. His co-star Cybil Shephard was the one with the Hollywood bonafides. That rapidly changed after Die Hard burst onto the scene. It's funny, grounded and full of some really great action. And yes, there's even a "Ho, Ho, Ho" thrown in there for good measure. Don't be distracted by the subpar sequels that have been churned out in recent years, the original is an all-time classic. There's even a genuine tale of romantic strife thrown in there for good measure. In fact, love is at the very center of what propels Willis' John McClane into action. So, when you put it that way, Die Hard isn't just a Christmas movie, IT'S A LOVE STORY.

Watch it Now: Die Hard, $7.99; on Amazon



6. The Nightmare Before Christmas

If you've already seen it, then you know. And if you haven't, you're understandably on the fence. Trust us, we get it. We were very late to the game on this one. That said, it's become an annual holiday must-see in our home ever since. Like some of the best Christmas tales, this one is truly bizarre from the opening scene to the final credits. It's covered in Tim Burton's elegant madness throughout and Danny Elfman's soundtrack is an all-time classic. And the stop motion animation that powers the film is both an homage to films of early Hollywood while simultaneously creating a cutting edge style that has proven influential across film, television and even video games ever since. We'd still love to see a sequel of spinoff, just don't set it during Halloween. Thats too obvious. The Fever Dream Before Easter? Where do we sign up?

Watch is Now: The Nightmare Before Christmas, $3.99; on Amazon


5 Elf

This might be the most easily crowd pleasing selection on our list. Released the same year as Love, Actually it was another movie that was a sizable hit at the time before exploding into all-time holiday film status in the ensuing years. Will Ferrell has made an entire career out of playing cynical and twisted characters but Elf is a reminder that his earliest roles were centered around surprisingly innocent characters with hearts of gold. As wholesome as it is, Elf relevant enough to sneakily draw in your emo niece. The movie is so universal that when a relative of mine "won" a narwhal ornament inspired by the film, she was genuinely confused and a little annoyed. I suggested she watch the movie before tossing the little trinket in the trash. This year? She brought it back to the gift exchange only to steal it back. Some people need to make a point.

Watch it Now: Elf (plus bonus features), $14.99; on Amazon


4. Gremlins

Some people describe Gremlins as one of the great "anti-Christmas" Christmas movies. We disagree. Gremlins is a proper Christmas movie to its core. It's values are so classic they are almost revolutionary as our main character and his family learn a lesson about appreciating relationships over materialism. Yeah, there's some death and destruction along the way. But also plenty of laughs. When Spike and his fellow Gremlins gather at the town theater for an evil movie marathon, the hijinks and tension hit incredible highs. Gizmo has some serious competition in Baby Yoda but remains one of the cutest characters of all-time.

Watch it Now: Gremlins, $6.99; on Amazon



3. Christmas Vacation

Chevy Chase was once the most popular comedic actor in the world. Just let that sink in. By the time 1989 rolled around, his Vacation series was seemingly out of steam. Yes, the original National Lampoon's Vacation is an all-time comedy classic and European Vacation has its fans as well. But along the way, Chase starred in a number of downright clunkers. Christmas Vacation surprised audiences with its sweet, naughty and yes, funny, moments that have made it become the most-viewed in the series. Co-star Beverly D'Angelo is there to humor Chase's Clark Griswold character and their characters have become prototypes for two generations of comedy families. There's additional star power in tow with Juliette Lewis and Johnny Galecki showing up as the ever-changing roster of Griswold children.

Watch it Now: Christmas Vacation, $14.99; on Amazon


2. The Lord of the Rings Trilogy

Sure, we could have gone with any number of traditional classics here like A Christmas Story but The Lord of the Rings is quite possibly the best movie, or rather, series of films, to binge watch during the holiday season. Fire up Fellowship of the Ring around Thanksgiving, move on to The Two Towers around Christmas and then wrap up with the epic finale Return of the King right before the New Year. You won't be disappointed. And while this series literally has nothing to do with the holidays on the surface, its absolutely driven by themes that personify the holiday season: family, resurrection, quiet heroism, magic and the power of tradition. There's not much else that needs to be said about this absolutely incredible series of films.

Watch it Now: The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring, $6.99; on Amazon


1. It's a Wonderful Life

The most obvious, traditional choice is suddenly the most revolutionary in some senses. While Gremlins gets tagged as the ultimate "anti-Christmas" Christmas movie, It's a Wonderful Life truly embodies the simple morality that is the best of the holiday season at its core. There's nothing cynical or winking here. It's all heart. The difficult personal themes explored throughout the film held it to being a modest success upon its release. But it's been an absolute juggernaut for decades now. We're recommending the more recent black & white restoration of the film, and especially the 4k version if you have the capacity in your home theater system. But like the film itself stresses, humble and simple is often best and you don't need a killer screen or sound system to absorb every ounce of depth from this one. When you're sitting around with those relatives or friends that we often take for granted, hold out for the inscription George finds at the end of his journey: "Remember, no man is a failure who has friends." Life is all about relationships and the holidays are a great time to rekindle and deepen the bonds that bring us true happiness.

Watch it Now: It's a Wonderful Life (Black & White version), $7.99; on Amazon


Upowrthy may receive a percentage of revenue from items purchased that are mentioned in this article


This article originally appeared on 12.29.19

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A mom had the best response after a neighbor complained about her toddler's sidewalk chalk

Well done.

via AktivierungsCoach-Geier/Pixabay

Sidewalk chalk incenses nosey neighbor.

No neighborhood would be complete without that one neighbor who complains about the pettiest things. The big problem comes when you live in a shared building or have a homeowner's association where that nosey neighbor has the power to make your life miserable.

Ashley Woodfolk, a young adult fiction writer in Brooklyn, couldn't believe that someone in her co-op complained about her toddler writing in sidewalk chalk in the courtyard of her building.

For those who live outside of New York City, a co-op is a type of housing where each resident is a shareholder in a corporation and pays for their living area based on its size. Co-ops usually have a committee or board that meets to handle issues that arise in the building.

It's incredible to believe that someone would be so shallow that they'd complain about a toddler drawing in sidewalk chalk. All it takes is a hose or a light rain and the chalk will disappear forever.

Furthermore, who would complain about a child drawing with sidewalk chalk during a pandemic when parents are rightfully afraid of their kids being exposed to the coronavirus?

Woodfolk was incensed that someone would make such a complaint. So she decided to apologize to the woman by writing a massive letter in the courtyard using sidewalk chalk.

"This will be my last time using sidewalk chalk in the courtyard since it seems to be such a problem for you (and only for you). I'm sorry harmless fun that brought my toddler joy (and has actually helped him learned all of his letters and most of his numbers –– his favorites are E and 8) causes you so much distress that you had to complain to the board and waste everyone's time when our building has much bigger real problems.

"I think you're aware that we're in a pandemic and while I'd love to take my kid to museums and the movies I don't feel safe doing that, and sometimes even local parks are more crowded than I'm comfortable with. The courtyard was a safe space but now there are limits on that too. There only a few weeks of nice weather left, and I sincerely hope you enjoy the use of the sidewalk-chalk free courtyard for the remainder of the fall. And I hope that every time it rains, rain that would have washed away any colorful ABCs I wrote on the ground, you think of me."

All my love, Ashley."

To make sure she got her message across, she also left a letter for the woman in the lobby of the building.


The woman got the message.



Woodfolk doesn't blame the board for having to hear about the complaint. She assumes they heard about it multiple times and had to give her the news because they didn't want to be harassed.



Let's hope that Woodfolk's dramatic reaction teaches the woman, and anyone else who wants to make petty complaints, that they should think twice before reporting someone to the board. They just might get a taste of their own pettiness in a glorious way.


This article originally appeared on 10.30.21

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Nature

Amazing footage shows a beluga whale playing 'fetch' with marine researchers

So great.

via The Guardian / YouTube

Beluga whales are affectionately known as sea canaries for their song-like vocalizations, and their name is the Russian word for "white."

They are sociable animals that live, hunt, and migrate together in pods, ranging from a few individuals to hundreds of whales. However, they are naturally reticent to interact with humans, although some solitary belugas are known to approach boats.

Once such beluga that's believed to live in Norwegian waters is so comfortable among humans that it played fetch with a rugby ball.

It's believed that the researchers in the video are on a South African vessel known as the Dinah Explorer. The video first appeared on Facebook where the poster was certain the researchers are South Africans celebrating their team's 2019 Rugby World Cup victory.

"Beluga Whale celebrating the Springboks victory somewhere close to the South Pole," Kowen wrote in the caption to the Facebook post. "Spot the Cape Town build Gemini Craft and the South African accents."

Some believe the whale could be the same one that caught the public's attention earlier this year for harassing Norwegian fisherman. The whale was wearing a harness that read "Equipment St. Petersburg" so many thought it was, at some point, trained by the Russian military. The harness has since been removed.

The whale went viral for fetching a phone that was dropped in the water by an eager fan.

"We laid down on the dock to look at it and hopefully get the chance to pat it," Ina Mansika told The Dodo. "I had forgotten to close my jacket pocket and my phone fell in the ocean. We assumed it would be gone forever, until the whale dove back down and came back a few moments later with my phone in its mouth!"

The whale returned the phone, but sadly it was no longer functional after falling into the frigid water.

This article originally appeared on 11.8.19

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Popular

Dad coaching his 4-yr-old through a harrowing cheer stunt mistake is peak patient parenting

There's no shortage of love, trust and security here.

Fan Favorite/Twitter, Roland Pollard/TikTok

Roland Pollard and his then 4-year-old daughter Jayden have been doing cheer and tumbling stunts together since Jayden could walk. When you see videos of their skills, the level of commitment is apparent—as is the supportive relationship this daddy has with his daughter.

Pollard, a former competitive cheerleader and cheer coach, told In The Know that he didn't expect Jayden to catch on to her flying skills at age 3, but she did. He said he never pressures her to perform stunts and that she enjoys it. And as a viral video of Jayden almost falling during a stunt shows, excelling at a skill requires good teaching—something Pollard appears to have mastered.

Twitter user Toya Rochelle shared a TikTok video of Pollard's in which Jayden makes a mistake on a move and falls. Pollard first checked to make sure she was okay. Then he matter-of-factly pointed out the mistake and explained the importance of listening to instructions, while also letting her know that he wasn't going to let her fall. "Daddy will always save you," he said.

Once she was calm and they'd talked through what happened, they tried again. This time, with success.

Another Twitter user pointed out that there was more video that followed this interaction, showing how sweet this dad-daughter duo's relationship really is. After a high-five and an "I'm so proud of you," Pollard asked if Jayden was ready to go get some ice cream, but she just wanted to go home and have some real food. Really, it's the little things in their exchange that are the sweetest. For instance, she accidentally kicks him when he puts her on his shoulders and says, "Sorry," and he instantly responds, "That's okay." So calm, so considerate. It's clear that there's no shortage of love, trust and security here.

Some watching the videos may feel that these kinds of cheer moves are too dangerous for a child. In an interview with E! News, Pollard explained that despite how the stunts may look to the public, he wouldn't let anything happen to Jayden.

"I believe that fear is a taught or learned trait and I've never given her a reason to be afraid," he said. "Any flyer I have trained knows that I will catch them if anything tragic goes wrong. She doesn't necessarily push me directly, but when I see she gets a skill down, I always try and make it harder. I love my daughter with all of my heart and would never put her at risk."

He also said he always tells her "Good job, mama!" after every stunt. "Before every stunt, I tell her I love her and give her a kiss for reassurance," he added. "We call it 'hardwood floor talk.'"


This article originally appeared on 8.7.20

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